I just put a HUGE amount of cash on Hughes. Is this a stupid decision or what? Everyone who wants to can weigh in on this topic! I am a huge Gracie fan, but tomorrow may be his "Randy Couture" retirement evening. (God, I hope he doesn't cry like Couture did!)

Hughes all the fucking way! The sport has really evolved and I think Gracie is just too old school to take it.

I hope you're right, if not I might need a place to stay b/c I probably won't make my house payment!

Grandfather of UFC going to teach student lesson :D

Blu: Your opinion appreciated, but grasshopper very unwise as to ways of evolution!

Hughes is younger, stronger, and more diversified than Gracie. Gracie never fought anyone like Hughes before, but Hughes has fought Gracie caliber fighters. Hughes in a unanimous decision.

it doesnt matter. I love the sport once and i get stable income will train in the art of ku fu fighting :D

Hughes, massive beat down. Gracie has never fought anyone with Hughes skills in the UFC.

Probably Hughes. How old is Hoyce now?

Matt Fucking Hughes

Gracie will win without too much difficulty. Gracie fought bigger dudes back in the day and now he's hand picked a guy (Hughes) who is lighter. Hughes doesn't know enough jiu-jitsu to hang with Gracie. How long has he trained jiu-jitsu? 5 years? Fighters are better now but still that's not enough. The only thing working to Hughes advantage is the fact that they stand the fighers up if things stall (Gracie not trying to work a submission from his guard), and Gracie can't wear his gee. But now there are time limits and rounds so Gracie won't wear himself out trying to work submissions (rather than "holding on" and waiting on his back).

I just put a HUGE amount of cash on Hughes. Is this a stupid decision or what? Everyone who wants to can weigh in on this topic! I am a huge Gracie fan, but tomorrow may be his "Randy Couture" retirement evening. (God, I hope he doesn't cry like Couture did!) :dontknow:

What price did you get on your bet?

I'm not a UFC fan or follower, but I know about the Gracie system - it works.

Hughes is good but Gracie is a legend. So I'm going with Gracie.

Matt Hughes.


The fight will end with a TKO after Gracie gets some ground and pound from Hughes. I think Hughes has enough ground game to stay out of Gracie's submissions and enough strength to throw Royce around.

This fight might have been more entertaining five years ago when Royce was still young.

I'll be there in person Saturday to root Hughes on. I'm also looking forward to seeing Diego Sanchez. He was injured last UFC and had to be replaced, so I can't wait to see him pick up where he left off.

Gracie.

I hope he smacks the smirk off Hughes face before he slaps on a submission.

Hughes should win, but Gracie could surprise. All it takes is one careless mistake and Royce wins.

Gracie surprised everyone back in the day...Americans always evolve. Gracie was great but he almost lost to Kimo, Almost lost to Shamrock and got out before his undefeated record was broken. The Gracies have lost several times in the Pride circuit.

I just put a HUGE amount of cash on Hughes. Is this a stupid decision or what? Everyone who wants to can weigh in on this topic! I am a huge Gracie fan, but tomorrow may be his "Randy Couture" retirement evening. (God, I hope he doesn't cry like Couture did!) Gracie was great, but he's old now.

cant wait until hughes arm is broken in half

after Gracie gets some ground and pound from Hughes
The really good Brazillian Jiu-jitsu dudes do NOT take punches when on their backs.

Yeah but they have ways to counter or protect themselves

I just put a HUGE amount of cash on Hughes. Is this a stupid decision or what? Everyone who wants to can weigh in on this topic! I am a huge Gracie fan, but tomorrow may be his "Randy Couture" retirement evening. (God, I hope he doesn't cry like Couture did!)

What I hear Hughes is the fav but after Iwacted the Gracie traininghe has a real good chace at this win. Matt better not make a mistake

also looking forward to Sanchez - guy is a fucking pitbull

The really good Brazillian Jiu-jitsu dudes do NOT take punches when on their backs.

Gracie wants to throw some puches and kicks-I can't wait
Watching The Fight at a friends new house breaking it in with lots of friends two kegs and lots of weed. Don't forget about all the kick ass seafood and steak

Blade Jones, no disrespect intended, but I don't think you've kept current with mixed martial arts at all. Gracie is my hero, he started me down the path, however the game has evolved way past the "gate keepers" abilities. While the fore fathers of MMA continued to stay the same, train the same and with the same people MMA has become the fastest growing sport in the world.

While I will be rooting for Royce, I'm 1000% sure that Matt will win. Royce cannot keep up the pace of Hughes, he shouldn't be able to submit him, nor can he KO him. Like I said I am praying Royce wins, for nostalgic reasons, it won't happen. Great BJJ players do get smashed routinely by punches from the guard, side mount, mount, rear mount and on their feet. Its not the same as when Royce was fighting 230lb brawlers with no ground experience.

I suggest you rent the more current UFC's, Pride, King of the Cage and other titles and you will see the sport for what it is now, not the past glory. I train every day with BJJ blackbelts, once you learn the positioning, get the conditioning, and the submission defense down, you can develop a ground and pound routine that will shatter their BJJ defenses, as long as you are capable of avoiding their attacks, you can tee off on them.

That being said, Royce has trained for the Ground and Pound, and is long and lean, a problem (body style) for Matt. He's been submitted before, the last being from BJ Penn, who is better then Royce on the ground and the feet. Look for Matt to get the ref stoppage.

almost lost to Kimo, Almost lost to Shamrock
Those guys were WAY bigger than Royce.


Pilot201 not all of those Brazillian JJ fighters in MMA are top notch. The really good dudes have the guard possition down so good that they just never get hurt. (I think it was) the guy who beat Hollywood Henderson in Pride who is one of 'em. I trained Machado Brazillian JJ for 3 1/2 years so maybe I'm partial towards Royce.

Of course Royce wouldn't be caught dead in the ring with many of the Pride fighters. The Pride fighters are better than the UFC fighters. I just hate the way they present it: Previously recorded, in a "boxing ring" and like the WWE.

They definatley are better in Pride, but that may be due to the difference in the rules. Look at Phil Baroni, he was getting beat by guys that came up from the smaller shows. He goes to Pride and he's on a tear, partially because he can juice over there, but also the Pride rules let him flourish. I am praying for Royce, he's a friggin Icon, and had such an impact on me. The BJJ guy you are referring to is Minotauro Nogueira.

He gets his fair share of damage on the ground from good strikers, such as Fedor. But he weathers the storm, and is a legit boxer himself, so he can inflict it just as well. Regardless of the outcome this will be a great fight. I think you and I are the only one's pulling for Royce right now.

Hughes by TKO. The only hope Gracie has is a submission. The new rules will limit Gracie - ie heel kicks.

Blade Jones, no disrespect intended, but I don't think you've kept current with mixed martial arts at all. Gracie is my hero, he started me down the path, however the game has evolved way past the "gate keepers" abilities. While the fore fathers of MMA continued to stay the same, train the same and with the same people MMA has become the fastest growing sport in the world.

While I will be rooting for Royce, I'm 1000% sure that Matt will win. Royce cannot keep up the pace of Hughes, he shouldn't be able to submit him, nor can he KO him. Like I said I am praying Royce wins, for nostalgic reasons, it won't happen. Great BJJ players do get smashed routinely by punches from the guard, side mount, mount, rear mount and on their feet. Its not the same as when Royce was fighting 230lb brawlers with no ground experience.

I suggest you rent the more current UFC's, Pride, King of the Cage and other titles and you will see the sport for what it is now, not the past glory. I train every day with BJJ blackbelts, once you learn the positioning, get the conditioning, and the submission defense down, you can develop a ground and pound routine that will shatter their BJJ defenses, as long as you are capable of avoiding their attacks, you can tee off on them.

That being said, Royce has trained for the Ground and Pound, and is long and lean, a problem (body style) for Matt. He's been submitted before, the last being from BJ Penn, who is better then Royce on the ground and the feet. Look for Matt to get the ref stoppage.

Very good analysis of the development of the sport. If you want to see a submission grappler with great striking skills shattering a guard, watch any Fedor-Minotauro fight. It's just a clinic on how to avoid submissions and maximize striking power against the guard from a safe and distanced position.

I see Hughes taking this one by unanimous decision. Royce will be able to close the distance but still should take a pounding. I actually see the crowd being bored during the fight. Royce will be clinching and locking from the guard to prevent getting his face smashed by the faster and stronger fighter.

Blade:

Hendo lost to Minotauro and Minotoro. I'm pretty sure their BJJ is top-notch, although I must admit that I don't have too much knowledge about what's being fed through the Brazilian pipeline outside of MMA.

The reason I brought up Fedor is because he has basically developed an anti-BJJ gameplan that seems flawless and implemented it against Big Nog and others. Shogun also demonstrated that great striking can still beat a solid BJJ guy if done correctly against Minotoro, too. And if you're a UFC guy, you should have seen the recent inadequacies that are apparent in Pe de Pano's fighting strategy.

Royce has been caught dead in the ring with Pride fighters. If you want to see another example of a submission wrestler dissecting a BJJ guy, watch his amazing 90 minute bout against Kazushi Sakuraba.

This all being said, Gracie is a 3:1 underdog. I'm not so sure he doesn't have a 30-35% chance of winning, so I'm putting a small wager on him as I see it being EV+. But I do seeing Hughes taking it in a lopsided decision.

I am pretty up to date on the progression of the sport, as I fell victim to it myself. I was a kickboxer, believed whole-heartedly in it. Then went to visit my uncle in Denver, he took me to UFC 1. I was in shock, couldn't believe my eyes. Went back to the pocono's and had no where to study grappling. So like so many, I bought tapes and taught myself.

Once I got tired of that I moved to Philly to train at Royce's affliliat there, then to Renzo's, then a sambo joint and got to the point where I wasn't striking anymore. Then started rolling with people who did both, and realized "shit, I spent so much time grappling, I missed the boat where people learned how to nullify the subs, and are tagging me with shots". So I had to go about the change all over again and get my personal formula to be 50% conditioning, 25% grappling, 25 % striking, that's what works best for me, and keeps me at my best. Other might need to do a different percentage breakdown, but that's what works best for me.

This is 100% no bullshit. I grew up one town over from Matt, he is from Hillsobro, IL. We played football against each other in high school. I don't think I can imagine meeting a tougher or meaner SOB than Matt Hughes and that was 10+ years ago.

Hughes is going to maul him. What type of money are you going to put on this? He's at -280, not good at all.

I would never bet against Matt. He's going to win, that's for sure. I'm still rooting for Royce though. It certainly doesn't look good for Royce, I mean he fought Tokoro in Japan last year, and Tokoro is a 140lb Judoka, he mauled Royce on the ground and on the feet. It went the time limit, and per the special rules (instituted by Royce) it went to a draw. Matt is a beast, he has had the best progression of any MMA fighter thus far, learned sub defense, learned how to sub, and strike, deadly..

Matt wins this one. I care more about the Lister/Sakara fight.

Gracie surprised everyone back in the day...Americans always evolve. Gracie was great but he almost lost to Kimo, Almost lost to Shamrock and got out before his undefeated record was broken. The Gracies have lost several times in the Pride circuit.

Pride has better fighters than UFC. Fighters that have been successful in UFC have gone to Pride and have their heads handed to them on a silver platter.

Pride has better fighters than UFC
AND they have some GNARLEY ass fights! Dudes getting knocked out cold. Emelianenko VS James the Collossas OR that Russian dude who is built like a tank knocking out that guy flat on his face like Apollo Creed.

Pride has better fighters than UFC. Fighters that have been successful in UFC have gone to Pride and have their heads handed to them on a silver platter.

That's a rash and inaccurate generalization. Although I do prefer Pride to UFC as well, to say their fighters in any division have more depth than say, UFC's WW division is just not accurate.

Mark Coleman, Josh Barnett, Phil Baroni, TK, and (technically speaking) Pride's most popular fighter (now K-1's?) Kazushi Sakuraba among others have had huge success in Japan after notable UFC stints.

In fact, no one has really had their asses handed to them by average or subpar Pride fighters that previously had UFC success, unless you count people like Mark Kerr and Vitor Belfort, who are sad exceptions to any rules.

There is plenty of room for 1, 2 or 8 MMA organizations. As long as the market is growing, there is incentive for promoters to offer new alternatives. It's an exciting time to be an MMA fan and see all of the changes and diversity among fighters. There's really no point in engaging in the invariable pissing contest about whether Pride > UFC. If you truly like MMA, you should be able to appreciate the strengths and weaknesses of each organization.

Hughes should win. As a pure wrestler as his background his stamina is far better than Gracie's. Gracie's stand up is really almost non existent. It is purely defensive.
His take down being the sole exception. Matt has shown kicking ability where Gracie's are just low kicks to distract. No power. Hughes can hit....hard! As far as heart they both have a huge amount but I can't
recall who was choking Matt out, Frank Trigg I think, but he seemed almost passed out, his face purple! Somehow he willed himself up and was able to bodyslam the guy with serious power.

Than again if he shows up cocky, lethargic and unfocused ( remember his loss?) it could be dangerous because in the end Gracie is a better submission guy than Hughes. You can't get lazy or complacent with Gracie, he'll find you!

I don't know how his skills are today vs the days the UFC emerged...

Hughes did win.

Seattle won shit, ever. Unless you count the Sonics in the 70's.

as expected, and sadly I might note...Hughes man-raped Royce from start to violent end.....

The really good Brazillian Jiu-jitsu dudes do NOT take punches when on their backs.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA!!!!

I think I pretty much called it exactly as it went down. Gracie lost after only 15 seconds of Matt's ground and pound! Hughes came close to submitting Royce on an arm lock only a minute before.