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"Redacted" stuns Venice
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| "Redacted" stuns Venice
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| NC-Stern-Mark |
By Silvia Aloisi
VENICE (Reuters) - A new film about the real-life rape and killing of a 14-year-old Iraqi girl by U.S. soldiers who also murdered her family stunned the Venice festival, with shocking images that left some viewers in tears.
"Redacted", by U.S. director Brian De Palma, is one of at least eight American films on the war in Iraq due for release in the next few months and the first of two movies on the conflict screening in Venice's main competition.
Inspired by one of the most serious crimes committed by American soldiers in Iraq since the 2003 invasion, it is a harrowing indictment of the conflict and spares the audience no brutality to get its message across.
De Palma, 66, whose "Casualties of War" in 1989 told a similar tale of abuse by American soldiers in Vietnam, makes no secret of the goal he is hoping to achieve with the film's images, all based on real material he found on the Internet.
"The movie is an attempt to bring the reality of what is happening in Iraq to the American people," he told reporters after a press screening.
"The pictures are what will stop the war. One only hopes that these images will get the public incensed enough to motivate their Congressmen to vote against this war," he said.
Abeer Qasim Hamza al-Janabi was gang raped, killed and burnt by American soldiers in Mahmudiya, south of Baghdad, in March 2006. Her parents and younger daughter were also killed.
Five soldiers have since been charged with the attack. Four of them have been given sentences of between 5 and 110 years.
"IT'S ALL ON THE INTERNET"
Halfway between documentary and fiction, "Redacted" draws on soldiers' home-made war videos, blogs and journals and footage posted on YouTube, reflecting changes in the way the media cover the war.
"In Vietnam, when we saw the images and the sorrow of the people we were traumatizing and killing, we saw the soldiers wounded and brought back in body bags. We see none of that in this war," De Palma said.
"It's all out there on the Internet, you can find it if you look for it, but it's not in the major media. The media is now really part of the corporate establishment," he said.
The film's title refers to how, according to De Palma, mainstream American newspapers and television channels are failing to tell the true story of the war by keeping the most graphic images of the conflict away from public opinion.
"When I went out to find the pictures, I said (to the media) give me the pictures you can't publish," he said, adding that because of legal dangers he too had to "edit" the material.
"Everything that is in the movie is based on something I found that actually happened. But once I had put it in the script I would get a note from a lawyer saying you can't use that because it's real and we may get sued," De Palma said.
"So I was forced to fictionalize things that were actually real."
The film, shot in Jordan with a little known cast, ends with a series of photographs of Iraqi civilians killed and their faces blacked out for legal reasons.
"I think that's terrible because now we have not even given the dignity of faces to this suffering people," De Palma said.
"The great irony about Redacted is that it was redacted."
Distributor Magnolia has planned a limited U.S. release for later this year, and the film may be easier to sell to European audiences rather than to the American public.
"This is a harrowing experience you put the audience through. It is not something you want to go to on a delightful Saturday evening but this message must be put forward and hopefully the public will respond," De Palma said.
Reuters 2007 |
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| VacateTheWord |
| Sorry, double post. |
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| VacateTheWord |
Brian De Palma is a piece of shit, but he's got some classic quotes:
"The movie is an attempt to bring the reality of what is happening in Iraq to the American people," he told reporters after a press screening.
Yeah, which is why he is showing the film in Venice. Not to mention that he is damaging America's image abroad.
De Palma, [...], makes no secret of the goal he is hoping to achieve with the film's images, all based on real material he found on the Internet.
Wow, great investigative work there, Brian. Got all of his information from the internet. If this were a paper he did in college, the professor would laugh, toss it back to him and tell him to do some credible research.
"The pictures are what will stop the war. One only hopes that these images will get the public incensed enough to motivate their Congressmen to vote against this war," he said.
[...]
The film, shot in Jordan with a little known cast, ends with a series of photographs of Iraqi civilians killed and their faces blacked out for legal reasons.
Here is the most heinous part of this scumbag's film - he is going to plaster the screen with pictures of dead Iraqis and, I would bet, will make no mention of the fact that the overwhelming majority of civilian deaths have been a result of terrorists and death squads in Iraq. Nope, he'll let the audience conclude that either American troops killed them or that the presence of American troops in Iraq is formenting this violence.
Brian De Palma is part of the Blame America First coalition and, judging from this article, just another dishonest liberal who hates his country . [/B] |
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| Reed Rothchild |
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheWord
Brian De Palma is a piece of shit, but he's got some classic quotes:
"The movie is an attempt to bring the reality of what is happening in Iraq to the American people," he told reporters after a press screening.
Yeah, which is why he is showing the film in Venice. Not to mention that he is damaging America's image abroad.
De Palma, [...], makes no secret of the goal he is hoping to achieve with the film's images, all based on real material he found on the Internet.
Wow, great investigative work there, Brian. Got all of his information from the internet. If this were a paper he did in college, the professor would laugh, toss it back to him and tell him to do some credible research.
"The pictures are what will stop the war. One only hopes that these images will get the public incensed enough to motivate their Congressmen to vote against this war," he said.
[...]
The film, shot in Jordan with a little known cast, ends with a series of photographs of Iraqi civilians killed and their faces blacked out for legal reasons.
Here is the most heinous part of this scumbag's film - he is going to plaster the screen with pictures of dead Iraqis and, I would bet, will make no mention of the fact that the overwhelming majority of civilian deaths have been a result of terrorists and death squads in Iraq. Nope, he'll let the audience conclude that either American troops killed them or that the presence of American troops in Iraq is formenting this violence.
Brian De Palma is part of the Blame America First coalition and, judging from this article, just another dishonest liberal who hates his country . [/B] |
What? These things didn't happen? Those soldiers are in jail for nothing? And Americans that kill and rape civilians in occupied lands are damaging our image abroad, not a filmmaker that tells people that those things happened. You really think that people are so stupid that if they hear about 5 soldiers committing crimes, that they will automatically assume that this is what the whole armed forces is about? Freedom is messy, people are free to do bad things, this happens in free countries. |
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| VacateTheWord |
Quote: Originally posted by Reed Rothchild
What? These things didn't happen? Those soldiers are in jail for nothing? And Americans that kill and rape civilians in occupied lands are damaging our image abroad, not a filmmaker that tells people that those things happened. You really think that people are so stupid that if they hear about 5 soldiers committing crimes, that they will automatically assume that this is what the whole armed forces is about? Freedom is messy, people are free to do bad things, this happens in free countries. |
Look, I'm not saying that corrupt members of the Armed Forces should not be held accountable and the public should not be made aware of such incidents, but when you are making a film, as this scumbag says, to "motivate their Congressmen to vote against this war," then he has a responsibility to balance his presentation with the good we are doing every day for the Iraqi people. If you want more information, click on the links I have in my signature.
The point is that if you make a film about Iraq and focus on a crime committed by rogue US forces...and that's all you show aside from pictures of dead Iraqis, then you are showing the audience (both home and abroad) a biased, and I dare say treasonous, presentation. |
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| atomizer |
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheWord
Look, I'm not saying that corrupt members of the Armed Forces should not be held accountable and the public should not be made aware of such incidents, but when you are making a film, as this scumbag says, to "motivate their Congressmen to vote against this war," then he has a responsibility to balance his presentation with the good we are doing every day for the Iraqi people. If you want more information, click on the links I have in my signature.
The point is that if you make a film about Iraq and focus on a crime committed by rogue US forces...and that's all you show aside from pictures of dead Iraqis, then you are showing the audience (both home and abroad) a biased, and I dare say treasonous, presentation. |
Portraying the truth is treasonous? Who are you? Chairman Mao? |
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| Reed Rothchild |
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheWord
Look, I'm not saying that corrupt members of the Armed Forces should not be held accountable and the public should not be made aware of such incidents, but when you are making a film, as this scumbag says, to "motivate their Congressmen to vote against this war," then he has a responsibility to balance his presentation with the good we are doing every day for the Iraqi people. If you want more information, click on the links I have in my signature.
The point is that if you make a film about Iraq and focus on a crime committed by rogue US forces...and that's all you show aside from pictures of dead Iraqis, then you are showing the audience (both home and abroad) a biased, and I dare say treasonous, presentation. |
That's just the thing though, he has made a film about a crime committed by our soldiers. That's what filmmakers do, they take a point of view and make a film about it. He's not reporting the news, and doesn't have to tell all sides of the story. Lobbyists get to try and influence congress everyday, and while most of them are scumbags, we don't say that they have to tell both sides of their story when they are doing their thing. |
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| Halcyon |
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheWord
then he has a responsibility to balance his presentation with the good we are doing every day for the Iraqi people. |
Wow! Are you one delusional fuck or what? Over 2 million Iraqi citizens have left the country, homeless. Because we created a civil war and can't even provide them with running water or even electricity for more than 6-8 hours a day. Nothing in an Iraqi citizen's life has changed for the better in over 4-5 fucking years and you have the absolute balls to claim we're doing "some good" over there because we killed a couple people and captured ANOTHER "#2 man in al-Qaida"!?!?!!?
You're an absolute disgrace of an American, and your stance on this war should be treasonous. Your family name should become a black mark in this country and should be synonymous with self-loathing, America hating, and freedom snatching. |
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| atomizer |
| Sooooooo, following on from Vacant, the famed impotent, DR whore-fucking, drug-trafficking Rush Limbag has a responsibility to balance his presentation with the bad that we are doing for the everyday life of the Iraqi people, too? |
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| Crazytree |
| this movie is not fair and balanced. |
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| Rike |
| To liberals "supporting the troops" means painting them all as rapists and baby killers. |
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| Crazytree |
Quote: Originally posted by Rike
To liberals "supporting the troops" means painting them all as rapists and baby killers. |
to Bushbots "supporting the troops" means sending them to die in a useless war and then posting on the internet how you "support them". |
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| harley-davidson |
Quote: Originally posted by Rike
To liberals "supporting the troops" means painting them all as rapists and baby killers. |
Supporting the troops to a conservative Bush ball licker is sending them to war without body armor or armored vehicles so they can salvage steel from disabled tanks, privatizing their mess hall so a private corporation can give them substandard food and water that makes them ill while charging the American tax payer 10 times what the armed forces could have done it for them selves . |
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| devolution420 |
| lol @ the truth being treasonous. |
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| Reverend Tyler |
| ITs a movie...to think it has to have both viewpoints is ridiculous... |
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| jigzaw |
Bullshit. This event did happen and maybe a movie can be made about it. But De Palma is saying that he made this movie to turn people against the Iraq War. Which is stupid because this sort of horrible thing happens in ALL wars. But the message he's conveying is that AMERICANS are evil child-rapists who should never go to war for any reason and that al-Qaeda should keep blowing them up because bin Laden is right. That's what De Palma's point is, so he can go fuck himself.
And I'M also against this war. But De Palma is a fucking backstabber. He has every right to do it, but I also have every right to tell him to go fuck himself with his propaganda. |
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| Reverend Tyler |
| Pretty strong indictment for someone who read an article about a film rather than actually seeing it. |
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| jigzaw |
Quote: Originally posted by Reverend Tyler
Pretty strong indictment for someone who read an article about a film rather than actually seeing it. |
Don't need to see it. He explains the point clearly in the interview. Not contributing one dollar to this project. Let Hezbollah distribute it. They will anyway. |
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| Reverend Tyler |
| so because he made a movie about horrors of war hoping it will encourage Americans to end the war he is making a propaganda film? that doesnt make any sense...you even admitted this event really happened. Kinda like Blackhawk Down...he was showing it in Venice because it was a fucking film festival and thats where new movies get premiered quite often. |
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| jigzaw |
It's a demoralization and a dishonest point of view he's presenting. He's saying "This is what American soldiers do", when it's what 6 asshole soldiers who are rotting in jail did. He's not talking about the lives that American soldiers have saved, or anything else. He's putting out the message that America is evil because it condones rape and murder as a matter of course.
And this sort of shit happens in every war. Is he against every war? Or just every war the U.S. is involved in? Or maybe just wars presided over by Republican politicians he'd like to see voted out?
It's propaganda because he actually said he's doing it to promote a specific political point of view. That's propaganda. It's not art. |
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| Reverend Tyler |
HEs not saying "this is what american soldiers do" hes saying "this is what happens when war demoralizes a human being, and look what we are doing to all our soldiers..and over what?"
And every piece of art is to promote a specific point of view |
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| jigzaw |
From De Palma:
"But this film is about Americans at war and what we do and we need to stomach it."
http://news.sky.com/skynews/article...1282351,00.html
From Wiki:
"Propaganda [from modern Latin: 'Propaganda Fide', literally “propagating the faith”] is a concerted set of messages aimed at influencing the opinions or behavior of large numbers of people. Instead of impartially providing information, propaganda in its most basic sense presents information in order to influence its audience. The most effective propaganda is often completely truthful, but some propaganda presents facts selectively to encourage a particular synthesis, or gives loaded messages in order to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the cognitive narrative of the subject in the target audience." |
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| Max-the-Silent |
Quote: Originally posted by Reverend Tyler
HEs not saying "this is what american soldiers do" hes saying "this is what happens when war demoralizes a human being, and look what we are doing to all our soldiers..and over what?"
And every piece of art is to promote a specific point of view |
Art is propaganda, and propaganda is art.
If somebody came out today with a WWII style movie about Iraq and Afghanistan, showing troops to be heroes, demonizing the enemy, and everybody comes home to live happily ever after, the film would be widely and loudly condemned, and rightfully so.
Make a movie that shows American troops as criminals, helpless victims, the public and the critics will think they're getting the straight stuff, the real story.
I've had to live with a certain amount of stigma and misunderstanding from certain people because of my veteran status. They look at me, see an in-shape, successful individual, and think everything's A.O.k. - they don't know about my emotional and physical problems. The other side of the coin - they see some guy that never got over his experience and can't function, they think that's what a veteran should be like .
The military of any nation is made up of individuals from the general population. Some guys will have the highest standards of personal behavior. Some guys will have no standards for anything. We used to weed out those individuals before they went too far in the training process - inducing stress and observing how the individual reacted to it. Those days are pretty much gone. The emphasis is on processing as many people through training as possible, with a minimum of "drops" from the programs. Losers make it through the process, get into a unit, and unless they act out bad enough, make it into the theater.
In theater, it's up to the NCO's to make sure shit like this rape/murder doesn't happen. In this case, an E5 was in on it - he got heavy time iirc.
De Palma's film? I won't see it. I'm not much of a war movie fan in any case.
I wasn't going to write this, but I know of a guy whose last words were "watch out for the kids!"
When somebody makes a movie about him, let me know. |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by jigzaw
From Wiki:
"Propaganda [from modern Latin: 'Propaganda Fide', literally “propagating the faith”] is a concerted set of messages aimed at influencing the opinions or behavior of large numbers of people. Instead of impartially providing information, propaganda in its most basic sense presents information in order to influence its audience. The most effective propaganda is often completely truthful, but some propaganda presents facts selectively to encourage a particular synthesis, or gives loaded messages in order to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the cognitive narrative of the subject in the target audience." |
...sounds like Fox News.
...jigsaw is quite the fucking moron...him and Vacunt make a dashing couple...
:rolleyes: |
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| ihateralphiec |
Gotta admit, I'm with Jigzaw on this.
For example, what group of people does America hold up in highest regard right now? Some could say firefighters if the lovefest hasn't worn of 9/11 aftermath yet. Now, some filmaker could probably find a group of total scumbag firefighters somewhere in this country that did some horrible shit and then make a movie about it. Guaranteed there would be at least a couple severe backlash incidents where innocent people get hurt or killed if the movie got any attention.
I'm not against DePalma making the movie in absolute terms, he can do what he wants, but we can call him out as an asshole because just he used no fucking judgement. This film could likely inflame some people and then those assholes take it out on the good guys.
This war is an absolute disgrace and if you hate it so much, there are probably 1000 other ways to get that story across, DePalma picked the worst possible crime committed by his own countrymen who in a sense had nothing to do with the USA going to war in the first place. |
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| jigzaw |
Quote: Originally posted by Fdubya247
...sounds like Fox News.
...jigsaw is quite the fucking moron...him and Vacunt make a dashing couple...
:rolleyes: |
Default Fdubya response. Anyone who deviates from the party line is a Bush-loving moron, right? Keep living in your simple world. |
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| jigzaw |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
This war is an absolute disgrace and if you hate it so much, there are probably 1000 other ways to get that story across, DePalma picked the worst possible crime committed by his own countrymen who in a sense had nothing to do with the USA going to war in the first place. |
Exactly. |
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| VacateTheWord |
Quote: Originally posted by jigzaw
It's a demoralization and a dishonest point of view he's presenting. He's saying "This is what American soldiers do", when it's what 6 asshole soldiers who are rotting in jail did. He's not talking about the lives that American soldiers have saved, or anything else. He's putting out the message that America is evil because it condones rape and murder as a matter of course.
And this sort of shit happens in every war. Is he against every war? Or just every war the U.S. is involved in?
It's propaganda because he actually said he's doing it to promote a specific political point of view. That's propaganda. It's not art. |
Exactly.
I would add - what about the atrocities committed by the death squads and terrorists? Is this scumbag going to even mention this, or merely point out how bad America is and let the audience "decide." Some would say that it goes without saying that Al Qaeda and death squads are evil, but personally I don't think it is said enough (this, by the way, would be a valid criticism of President Bush). This is the same method that Hezbollah used during the summer war in 2006 - show civilian casualties and make Israel look like the bad guy and let's all ignore the thousands of Ketushya rockets Hezbollah was raining down on Israel.
He is entitled to his opinion but, by his own admission, he is tacitly aiding the enemy by attempting to sway US public opinion against our efforts, which are noble and just. You can't single out one incident and portray that as the Iraq war - it's disengenuous to put it lightly.
Brian De Palma is an un-patriotic piece of shit. |
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| atomizer |
To my knowlege, Brian DePalma has broken no laws whatsoever in conceiving, producing, and distributing this movie. It would probably constitute his vision, or at the very least something he wants to attach his name to. As far as I'm concerned, he and his production and distribution companies have every fucking right in the world to open it for public viewing.
As this is still America, you have three legitimate courses of action: don't spend your money on it, exercise your right to free speech with regard to it, and make a movie rebutting each and every point you feel he makes.
Calling someone out for treason for making a film based upon public record is not actionable. He has no obligation to you whining bush-shits whatsoever. |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by jigzaw
Default Fdubya response. Anyone who deviates from the party line is a Bush-loving moron, right? Keep living in your simple world. |
...the only thing "default" is the level of your ignorance. What party-line are you talking about? |
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| ihateralphiec |
Quote: Originally posted by atomizer
To my knowlege, Brian DePalma has broken no laws whatsoever in conceiving, producing, and distributing this movie. It would probably constitute his vision, or at the very least something he wants to attach his name to. As far as I'm concerned, he and his production and distribution companies have every fucking right in the world to open it for public viewing.
As this is still America, you have three legitimate courses of action: don't spend your money on it, exercise your right to free speech with regard to it, and make a movie rebutting each and every point you feel he makes.
Calling someone out for treason for making a film based upon public record is not actionable. He has no obligation to you whining bush-shits whatsoever. |
I hate Bush, but De Palma just got knocked down a few notches in my book.
A movie maker always has a purpose to his work of art. If DePalma is against all war, including wars like WWII, then fine, make this movie to show how everyone is dehumized in situations of war. But he made this movie to make America look bad because he doesn't like THIS war. He used bad judgement. It wasn't treason, it wasn't illegal, but he's an ASSHOLE for making it. |
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| Fdubya247 |
War is Hell. That is something "we" all should have known. Acts like this were a foregone conclusion when "we" decided to invade another country. Murder, rape, maiming, destruction, horror...
That is the point DePalma is making.
Sorry reality isn't all "flowers and candy"...heck, it wasn't flowers and candy AT ALL. Never has been.
War is Hell. We visited it upon the Iraqi people. Its on our heads (if not your conservative "consciences").
Sorry you don't like having it shoved in your stupid faces...
Think twice next time before you chickenhawk faggots support another war. |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
I hate Bush, but De Palma just got knocked down a few notches in my book.
A movie maker always has a purpose to his work of art. If DePalma is against all war, including wars like WWII, then fine, make this movie to show how everyone is dehumized in situations of war. But he made this movie to make America look bad because he doesn't like THIS war. He used bad judgement. It wasn't treason, it wasn't illegal, but he's an ASSHOLE for making it. |
It's a metaphor for all War, genius. That is how art works. |
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| VacateTheWord |
Quote: Originally posted by Fdubya247
...the only thing "default" is the level of your ignorance. What party-line are you talking about? |
I have to go with Fdub on this one - he is not a loyal Democat as much as he is akin to the DailyKos imbiciles. True, the Democrats pander to this mob, but the minute one of the Democrats deviates from their Marxist/Stalinist agenda they are thrown under the bus. So his loyalty lies with the fringe radicals first. |
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| jigzaw |
Quote: Originally posted by Fdubya247
War is Hell. That is something "we" all should have known. Acts like this were a foregone conclusion when "we" decided to invade another country. Murder, rape, maiming, destruction, horror...
That is the point DePalma is making.
Sorry reality isn't all "flowers and candy"...heck, it wasn't flowers and candy AT ALL. Never has been.
War is Hell. We visited it upon the Iraqi people. Its on our heads (if not your conservative "consciences").
Sorry you don't like having it shoved in your stupid faces...
Think twice next time before you chickenhawk faggots support another war. |
Acts like this happen in every city in the country. Should we abolish all cities?
You also don't seem to notice that a lot of us who are pissed at DePalma are not Bush supporters or supporters of the Iraq War. Makes your head spin to consider a subtle thing like that doesn't it? |
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| atomizer |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
I hate Bush, but De Palma just got knocked down a few notches in my book.
A movie maker always has a purpose to his work of art. If DePalma is against all war, including wars like WWII, then fine, make this movie to show how everyone is dehumized in situations of war. But he made this movie to make America look bad because he doesn't like THIS war. He used bad judgement. It wasn't treason, it wasn't illegal, but he's an ASSHOLE for making it. |
Fine. We're in agreement about his right to conceive, produce, film and dististribute this thing. It's your right to call him an asshole, too.
Talking about bad judgement, though...perhaps bad judgement begets bad judgement?
Why don't all you guys who are so lost emotionally about this band together and executive produce a film about how this incident didn't happen? You can do that. Secure some financing, and stop moaning. Get to work on it. |
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| VacateTheWord |
Quote: Originally posted by Fdubya247
War is Hell. That is something "we" all should have known. Acts like this were a foregone conclusion when "we" decided to invade another country. Murder, rape, maiming, destruction, horror...
That is the point DePalma is making.
Sorry reality isn't all "flowers and candy"...heck, it wasn't flowers and candy AT ALL. Never has been.
War is Hell. We visited it upon the Iraqi people. Its on our heads (if not your conservative "consciences").
Sorry you don't like having it shoved in your stupid faces...
Think twice next time before you chickenhawk faggots support another war. |
Well from De Palma's comments about the film he's made it seems that you are right in line with his viewpoint...America is bad, ignore the rest.
"We" should have known that "war is hell?" How fast you forget 9/11.
And let's turn a blind eye to the countless amount of death and destruction wrought by Al Qaeda in Iraq and the death squads.
Nope, America is to blame for it all. So going by your logic, once we leave everything in Iraq will be peace, love and understanding.
You are the most naive person in the world. |
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| Reverend Tyler |
Quote: Originally posted by Fdubya247
It's a metaphor for all War, genius. That is how art works. |
Conservative-minded people have trouble interpreting art |
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| Reverend Tyler |
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheWord
Well from De Palma's comments about the film he's made it seems that you are right in line with his viewpoint...America is bad, ignore the rest.
"We" should have known that "war is hell?" How fast you forget 9/11.
And let's turn a blind eye to the countless amount of death and destruction wrought by Al Qaeda in Iraq and the death squads.
Nope, America is to blame for it all. So going by your logic, once we leave everything in Iraq will be peace, love and understanding.
You are the most naive person in the world. |
9/11 and Iraq have nothing to do with each other, quit trying to link them |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by jigzaw
Acts like this happen in every city in the country. Should we abolish all cities? |
...more cockroach "lojik"...
:rolleyes:
Quote: Originally posted by jigzaw
You also don't seem to notice that a lot of us who are pissed at DePalma are not Bush supporters or supporters of the Iraq War. Makes your head spin to consider a subtle thing like that doesn't it? |
...there is nothing subtle about your stupidity and ignorance... |
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| Crazytree |
Quote: Originally posted by Reverend Tyler
Conservative-minded people have trouble interpreting art |
since stereotype from a so-called "tolerant liberal" :rolleyes:
explain THAT shit. |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheTurd
Well from De Palma's comments about the film he's made it seems that you are right in line with his viewpoint...America is bad, ignore the rest. |
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
(I don't think I've EVER done a triple...)
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheTurd
"We" should have known that "war is hell?" How fast you forget 9/11. |
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
(two records broken with one post...wow!)
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheTurd
And let's turn a blind eye to the countless amount of death and destruction wrought by Al Qaeda in Iraq and the death squads.
Nope, America is to blame for it all. |
"America" (bush/GOP and their slavering followers) isn't the reason AQ is there in the first place?
Way to connect the dots, Sparky.
:rolleyes:
Quote: Originally posted by VacateTheTurd
So going by your logic, once we leave everything in Iraq will be peace, love and understanding. You are the most naive person in the world. |
...it will be a start.
:rolleyes: |
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| atomizer |
| Say 'hello' to my new desktop wallpaper... |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by Reverend Tyler
Conservative-minded people have trouble interpreting art |
...forget "interpretation", apparently they don't understand the concept of art, period!
Fucking Neanderthals...
:ps: |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by Reverend Tyler
9/11 and Iraq have nothing to do with each other, quit trying to link them |
"...Just Another Day...."
:rolleyes: |
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| ihateralphiec |
Quote: Originally posted by Fdubya247
It's a metaphor for all War, genius. That is how art works. |
No shit it is a metaphor for all war, everyone gets that. But the timing is only because of this war and it is done in a way to make soldiers look bad when 1000 other movies could have made the same general point about war based more around the decisions of Bush, Cheney, etc... look bad. The biggest problem with his specific movie is the timing, US Soldiers are still in Iraq, and whether it is Bush's fault or not, it isn't getting any easier for the guys over there right now. His movie will do nothing to get troops home quicker, it will only get more people incensed at not just our Government, where the anger should be directed, but also at our troops.
In my opinion, he has sunk to Rush's level to make a point. |
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| atomizer |
Boohoohoo. my fragile sensibilities are hurt by a bad man who made a film that I don't agree with...sniff! I need to cry and scream about it.
Grow up, shitheads. It exists, just as opinions in MANY forms exist about the horrible mistake the people you support have made. Get over it. This should be the end of this thread. Should be, but won't be. |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
No shit it is a metaphor for all war, everyone gets that. But the timing is only because of this war and it is done in a way to make soldiers look bad when 1000 other movies could have made the same general point about war based more around the decisions of Bush, Cheney, etc... look bad. The biggest problem with his specific movie is the timing, US Soldiers are still in Iraq, and whether it is Bush's fault or not, it isn't getting any easier for the guys over there right now. His movie will do nothing to get troops home quicker, it will only get more people incensed at not just our Government, where the anger should be directed, but also at our troops.
In my opinion, he has sunk to Rush's level to make a point. |
...the only people stupid enough not to understand that these guys don't represent "the troops" as a whole, would be "conservatives". They aren't going to see the movie.
The audiences will be made up of people who are smart enough to "get it"...
...the fact that your anger at the film is because of "the timing" and because "it might make the troops look bad", is incredibly STUPID at best. Do you have any sense of proportion?
I mean, give me a fucking break...
:rolleyes: |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by atomizer
Boohoohoo. my fragile sensibilities are hurt by a bad man who made a film that I don't agree with...sniff! I need to cry and scream about it.
Grow up, shitheads. It exists, just as opinions in MANY forms exist about the horrible mistake the people you support have made. Get over it. This should be the end of this thread. Should be, but won't be. |
...getting upset at this non-issue only exposes further what THEY DON'T get upset about, and shows what goddamn pea-brained Cunts they are.... |
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| ihateralphiec |
Quote: Originally posted by atomizer
Fine. We're in agreement about his right to conceive, produce, film and dististribute this thing. It's your right to call him an asshole, too.
Talking about bad judgement, though...perhaps bad judgement begets bad judgement?
Why don't all you guys who are so lost emotionally about this band together and executive produce a film about how this incident didn't happen? You can do that. Secure some financing, and stop moaning. Get to work on it. |
If I thought DePalma had no talent, I wouldn't be concerned about his bad judgement. But just like all other people at the top of their game, I expect more out of them than the average person.
None of us will bankroll a talk show to compete with Rush because he is a dick, we won't start our own record label because top 40 music sucks worse than ever. Why, because this is a forum where we post our opinions and most of us probably have average jobs. |
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| ihateralphiec |
Quote: Originally posted by Fdubya247
...the only people stupid enough not to understand that these guys don't represent "the troops" as a whole, would be "conservatives". They aren't going to see the movie.
The audiences will be made up of people who are smart enough to "get it"...
...the fact that your anger at the film is because of "the timing" and because "it might make the troops look bad", is incredibly STUPID at best. Do you have any sense of proportion?
I mean, give me a fucking break...
:rolleyes: |
No, I have a sense of history.
Vietnam for those on the left agree was a bad war. They were right to protest it, but there were many that took the extra step to spit on the soldiers. It wasn't happening from day one, but at some point it started happening. Somehow the protest movement got to that point. This movie takes one step in that direction, that is all. It will take a little more hostility for it to get to the point of violence to soldiers, but DePalma chose to be in the mix of people to potentially build that momentum. |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
No, I have a sense of history.
Vietnam for those on the left agree was a bad war. They were right to protest it, but there were many that took the extra step to spit on the soldiers. It wasn't happening from day one, but at some point it started happening. Somehow the protest movement got to that point. This movie takes one step in that direction, that is all. It will take a little more hostility for it to get to the point of violence to soldiers, but DePalma chose to be in the mix of people to potentially build that momentum. |
...The only people that didn't learn anything from 'Nam are "conservatives"...
EVERYONE knows its our "leaders" who are to blame. Anyone who doesn't is a fucking moron, and "liberals" will be the first to say so.
:rolleyes: |
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| atomizer |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
If I thought DePalma had no talent, I wouldn't be concerned about his bad judgement. But just like all other people at the top of their game, I expect more out of them than the average person.
None of us will bankroll a talk show to compete with Rush because he is a dick, we won't start our own record label because top 40 music sucks worse than ever. Why, because this is a forum where we post our opinions and most of us probably have average jobs. |
And my opinion is that you people might want to do something more constructive than call some director who has done everything he was entitled to have done within the scope of our laws names for presuming to disagree with you.
Get used to being offended, ihrc. There have been a lot of things that have occurred over the last six years that have offended me, too. Brian DePalma and his film I'll never see don't even touch my radar on all that.
Grow up, for fuck's sake. There's an abomination of a war going on with stacks of corpses every day, and you don't like Brian DePalma? Where are your fucking priorities, you crybaby? |
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| ihateralphiec |
Quote: Originally posted by atomizer
Grow up, for fuck's sake. There's an abomination of a war going on with stacks of corpses every day, and you don't like Brian DePalma? Where are your fucking priorities, you crybaby? |
So because an abomination of a war is going on, and that is also my view if you have paid attention, I cannot agree with all tactics of the left. Sorry I pointed out that DePalma might be picking the wrong battles and actually might harm some people indirectly by his actions that he might claim to support.
Sorry, I'll grow up and make no more disagreements with anything perceived liberal on this forum. I'll keep all opinions to myself. It seems odd that if this issue isn't worth disagreeing over or even talking about, you would waste time to tell me to grow up, where are your priorities? |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
Sorry I pointed out that DePalma might be picking the wrong battles and actually might harm some people indirectly by his actions that he might claim to support. |
...sorry we think that's stupid, and are saying so...just our opinion...
:rolleyes: |
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| ihateralphiec |
Quote: Originally posted by Fdubya247
...The only people that didn't learn anything from 'Nam are "conservatives"...
EVERYONE knows its our "leaders" who are to blame. Anyone who doesn't is a fucking moron, and "liberals" will be the first to say so.
:rolleyes: |
All (insert here) people are bad, all (insert here) people are good has never worked for me in my lifetime. Oh, I've heard it filled in with lots of names over and over, but my perception has been it always seemed too simplistic.
Would this make everyone feel better? DePalma is doing no different than Rush on his daily talk show. That's my whole point. |
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| Fdubya247 |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
All (insert here) people are bad, all (insert here) people are good has never worked for me in my lifetime. Oh, I've heard it filled in with lots of names over and over, but my perception has been it always seemed too simplistic. |
....I guess that's why the point has gone over your head...
:rolleyes:
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
Would this make everyone feel better? DePalma is doing no different than Rush on his daily talk show. That's my whole point. |
...you are accusing DePalma of being a LIAR?!?!?!
Where is your proof?
:rolleyes: |
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| atomizer |
Quote: Originally posted by ihateralphiec
So because an abomination of a war is going on, and that is also my view if you have paid attention, I cannot agree with all tactics of the left. Sorry I pointed out that DePalma might be picking the wrong battles and actually might harm some people indirectly by his actions that he might claim to support.
Sorry, I'll grow up and make no more disagreements with anything perceived liberal on this forum. I'll keep all opinions to myself. It seems odd that if this issue isn't worth disagreeing over or even talking about, you would waste time to tell me to grow up, where are your priorities? |
Drop the passive-aggressive sarcasm, ihrc. That's low.
What issue IS there about a film some filmmaker and the distributor legally releases, apart from the fact that it offends your pristine feelings? DON'T GO SEE IT if you don't like it. I don't watch Fox News.
This is about you, frankly. You and your problem with the subject matter, and why you have a problem with the subject matter.
As I stated up there, I get daily, horrible offence from Rush, Sean, Bill, Brit, and the rest. I'd make a pretty decent fucking case for them to be strung up on treason charges, but I don't. Get over it, man. There are so many worse things out there to get upset about than some movie. |
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