Question for the liberals on oil prices

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...soline-prices/2012/03/01/gIQAtWkXlR_blog.html

"Clearly oil experts disagree on whether prices will be affected, but those who believe as a matter of economics that it will ease prices say the impact will be modest. Indeed, even the TransCanada executive, who had a stake in touting the project, used the word “could,” not “will” like Upton."


It wouldn't even put a dent in prices.

Here is a report on it done by Cornell University:
http://www.ilr.cornell.edu/globallaborinstitute/research/upload/GLI_KeystoneXL_Reportpdf.pdf

Keystone XL is an export pipeline. According to presentations to investors, Gulf Coast refiners plan to refine the cheap Canadian crude supplied by the pipeline into diesel and other products for export to Europe and Latin America. Proceeds from these exports are earned tax-free.

• By draining Midwestern refineries of cheap Canadian crude into export-oriented refineries in the Gulf Coast, Keystone XL will increase the cost of gas for Americans.
• TransCanada’s 2008 Permit Application states “Existing markets for Canadian heavy crude, principally PADD II [U.S. Midwest], are currently oversupplied, resulting in price discounting for Canadian heavy crude oil. Access to the USGC [U.S. Gulf Coast] via the Keystone XL Pipeline is expected to strengthen Canadian crude oil pricing in [the Midwest] by removing this oversupply. This is expected to increase the price of heavy crude to the equivalent cost of imported crude. The resultant increase in the price of heavy crude is estimated to provide an increase in annual revenue to the Canadian producing industry in 2013 of US $2 billion to US $3.9 billion.”
• Independent analysis of these figures found this would increase per-gallon prices by 20 cents/gallon in the Midwest.
• According to an independent analysis U.S. farmers, who spent $12.4 billion on fuel in 2009 could see expenses rise to $15 billion or higher in 2012 or 2013 if the pipeline goes through. At least $500 million of the added expense would come from the Canadian market manipulation.

nice try. talking point failed

i never said it would blast prices down
but it would bring them down some
commodities usually follow a pattern unless someone or thing is influencing to another postion

The whole pipeline argument is a moot point anyway. It will take at least a couple of years for it to be completed and online. Who knows what the situation will be then.

Good point my friend

That has been an argument for far too long. If we had done more 10 or 20 years ago we wouldn't be in the situation we are now.

And if my aunt had a penis she would be my uncle. There is still no proof that the pipeline is going to lower prices a single penny. We are also drilling more now than we have in 20 years and look how the prices have dropped.

thank you?

Bullshit. I would applaud action to bring down prices. First and quickest would be to reduce the regulations on summer blends, instant 10 cents min., approve Keystone, open new lands for drilling, speed the permitting process for new wells.

No fake outrage. The high prices are putting pressure on my business at a time when increasing prices to my customers isn't really an option. Not to mention the budget at home with running kids to school and soccer practice it really adds up.

see above.

It's not my contention, it's a fact. Prices went down about 7c/gal as soon as the report came out. So what is it you are babbling about?


You are very quick to accuse others of spouting talking points, yet you are doing the same. Why don't you try a little independent thought? Or is that just too much effort?

Thanks nun, but I have to admit I always find it amusing when I get attacked by the left here as a right-wing hack. It clearly says more about those making the accusations than it does about me!

And there is no proof that it wouldn't. And it thought it was 10 years? But let's be honest, the increased drilling is either stuff approved by Bush or on state lands not federal (like in ND). Obama is trying to take credit for that, but we all know it's bullshit.

That is also a moot point. Drilling is at a high point and gas prices are still rising. That alone should be proof that a pipeline isn't the answer.

Since Obama has taken office, the US has produced more domestic oil and purchased less foreign oil than ever.
The latest report on high gas prices claims the primary reason is that Wall Street speculators are speculating on higher oil prices which is, in fact, driving up the price of oil.
On this very site, during the last months of the Bush administration when gas was over $4 a gallon, I was blaming Bush but all the bushbots were flaming me and saying Bush had nothing to do with those prices. Those very same people are now blaming Obama. I find it curious.
Obama may share a bit of the blame, however, by not being more aggressive during his first two years in office when he had the political clout to affect many of the triggers that allow the price of oil to fluctuate so radically.
Having said that, Obama (in my opinion) has been nothing less than spectacular in the things he has managed to accomplish even while dealing with the most obstructionist GOP in history. I look forward to another 4 years of his leadership when the necessary distraction of another campaign is removed from the equation.

first off ROFL
now what did obama do to change things that affect the triggers that allow oil to fluctuate so radically

transcanada's own application spells out that prices will go up WITH the pipeline.

are you going to address the divide between your talking point and reality?

in addition to the absolute fact that increased drilling has not led to lower prices.
that is 2 fallacies minimum in your statement

go...

you just have to use common sense instead of right wing talking points. why would an oil company be looking to lower prices? duh

he is beating the drums for war in Iran dontcha know
do you republic party members even think this shit through or just repeat what fox says? too easy

if you spout right wing talking points you get labeled as a right wing hack. just because you don't care about the social agenda means nothing. shit it doesn't even change who you are going to vote for
be a man. and praise from a poster operating on about 4 brain cells means nothing

And don't forget, lowering taxes brings happiness to the job creators and they... create jobs.

Obama has done more to explain the triggers and circumstances of the rising prices. Bush pretty much shrugged them off. I probably placed more blame on him than he deserved but, honestly, by that point of his presidency, I was fed up with one mismanaged crisis after another.

He did nothing to change the triggers. That is one of the issues I had with him early on. I had always advocated for nationalizing the oil industry, limiting profits, etc. Raising taxes on the oil companies and using that income to subsidize the price at the pumps may have been another option.

Maybe in his second term.